Bible, Bros & Brew
Bible, Bros, & Brew is all about helping you navigate your relationship with God in practical, real-life ways. Hosts David and Phil dig into scripture—'chopping up the word'—and bring it to life with insights you can actually use every day. And while they’re at it, they share their favorite 'brews'—don’t worry, it’s not booze! Just a solid lineup of classic coffees and teas to keep the conversations flowing.
Bible, Bros & Brew
How to Keep From Falling (Part 2): Drawing Strength from God's Word | Bible, Bros & Brew
We've all seen it: Prominent pastors, evangelists, musicians, and other well-known figures in the body of Christ getting exposed for scandalous moral failures of one sort or another. What in the world is going on? Why does it seem like so many things that were hidden or covered up are now being revealed and exposed for all to see? And for the people who have been involved in these scandals, how in the world did they get there? In this second installment of our new series called "How to Keep From Falling", David and Phil dig into the scriptures to find out what God says about the importance of maintaining an authentic relationship with Him, which will help keep the door closed to temptation, distraction and derailment.
gotbrew@biblebros.net
It seems like every day there's some type of new scandal breaking out with prominent figures in the body of Christ. It could be pastors, musicians, different ministry situations where some type of moral failure has taken place. And if you're like me, you're sitting here going man, you know what happened. I mean, all of us, of course, have sinned, but sometimes you hear about stories where people have been living double lies for a long time, or they presented themselves one way, but then we find out later that that was not what they were really doing in their private life and you have to ask the question it's like what could have caused this and how can someone prevent that type of thing, this type of sin problem, from spiraling out of control? So that's what we want to talk about today.
Phillip Rich:On Bible Bros and Brew, my name is Philip and, of course, with me is the illustrious David in the middle there and John to the far right with his headphones on. So we have been. We actually just kicked off a new series last week where we talked about this concept, of this idea of how to keep from falling, because, as most of us are well aware, it just seems like there's a lot of things going on in the body of Christ. Right now there's a headline that recently came out a very, very famous musician been doing Christian music for decades who just recently came out and confessed he's been living a double life, not only doing some sexual stuff he shouldn't have been doing, but also drugs and alcohol. So it's just one of many things that have popped off lately that you know. Honestly, it has a lot of people scratching their heads. They're like man, what about? You know? How in the world did someone get to this place? And, as I said, probably last week, I think.
David McIntyre:And we thought, and we thought, you were the stable.
Phillip Rich:Right, right, we thought you were, yeah, yeah, that's the sad thing about it, it's like the one that we thought was really walking the walk turned out to be the one that, uh, wasn't probably not any better off than than the people he was preaching to, you know, or whatever the case was. But, um, and, and that's my god, my god, it's a tragic thing, man. It's a tragic thing, man. It's a tragic thing because, you know, a lot of times we think about how this person may have started in their journey with Christ.
Phillip Rich:You know, like most of us, when they first got born again, you're fired up, you're on fire for the Lord, you want to leave all the past behind. You want to, you know, do your best to overcome sin. But then, you know, and after a while you just kind of come to this place of just amazing fellowship with God. But then, as the journey goes on, all of a sudden maybe you get complacent, maybe you take your eyes off the prize, maybe you stop abiding in him or abiding in his word, and you start seeking the things of the world again. Maybe the the tentacles of the world never really, you know let you go like you thought they did.
David McIntyre:Whatever the case is, what does that scripture say? The lust of the world and the and the cares for all these things enter in yep and choke the word.
Phillip Rich:That's mark four. You know Jesus talked about it. He's like the seed sown on thorny ground. That's what it was.
David McIntyre:Right.
Phillip Rich:It's like, after a while, the cares of this world, the deceitfulness of riches, the lust of other things, the lust of other things.
Phillip Rich:Come in and choke the word and it becomes unfruitful. And I mean, we see that you know there's so many examples of this. And I mean we see that you know there's so many examples of this. There's one of the minister, mike Bickle, who very publicly it's been known that he was sexually abusing several different women in his church for years. And you know one of the big things that people always said that was like a point of like oh look, how humble he is. They were like you know he he barely even spends any of his income. He makes a lot of money because his ministry is huge, but he normally doesn't spend any of it on himself. Come to find out he was spending it on hotels and other places. He was taking these women to do what he was doing. And it's like man, my goodness, dude. And then, of course, presenting a completely different face when they're doing ministry. And it's like how in the world can your heart get so hard? You know, how in the world can you have such an insanely concrete dividing wall between who you are in private versus who you are publicly?
Phillip Rich:And we've heard even the scandal that happened with Ravi Zacharias. You know a lot of it was found out after he passed, dude had a legit double life. I mean complete double life. He was out there as one of the top apologists for the Christian faith, famous speaker all over the world. But then we find out I mean I'm talking complete double life he was, he was doing some wild stuff in massage parlors and parts of asia and and he had a whole different phone that his wife didn't even know about, where he was keeping pictures of girls on it and I mean it was just a bad, bad thing. And it's like you know you sit here and wonder where and how could this possibly happen? Especially for people who, when you hear how they minister, you hear how they sing for the Lord, when you hear their preaching, it's like dude, they know God, you know that's what you're thinking. You know it's like man, they have a gift, they can preach, they can teach. But then you find out in their private life they're just, I mean.
David McIntyre:Dead man's bones.
Phillip Rich:Yeah, there you go and it's like how did this happen, dude? Somewhere along the way, their private fellowship with God either was almost non-existent or was on the way to being non-existent. I can't think of any other way that something like that can happen. Dave, what are your just initial thoughts about this man?
David McIntyre:man. I don't know, I might need to wait, phillip, because you know, I just um, I just today sat back and listened to Michael Tate's confession. He released a press release and confessed to the world that pretty much the gist of what they heard about him is true. And it's like you know, you're sitting up there and you're talking about Ravi and I'm thinking about. I've been thinking about Michael and DC Talk all day. Dc Talk was the band that, when I got born again, helped me to stay focused in Christ. When I made the decision that I was not going to listen to any more secular music. Dc Talk and Crystal Lewis and those couple of tapes Trinity 5-7 and a few others those tapes literally kept me in the game.
David McIntyre:Those things would flip over, and over, and over and over and over in my car.
Jon Dzyuba:And.
David McIntyre:I'm like these guys got me through. And then we find out a couple of years ago, one of them decides to deconstruct and in other words he says he's not walking away from God, he's just walking away from Christianity. And I'm like, dude, you're walking away from God, you're walking away to go, do what you want to do and be able to justify what you want to do, without the confines of this whole christ thing.
David McIntyre:To hold you back and you want to create a god of your own making yeah, out of your own mind and you know, I was listening to michael today and I was like you know, you are the one that we all thought had it most together. Yeah, you're the one. Yeah, and to find out for the last 20 years and I love. Well, not love. But he said something that you just said, philip. You just said a little differently. He said I was one way on Sundays and Mondays at home, I was a whole nother person.
Phillip Rich:Wow, my goodness man.
David McIntyre:And you get to a point where you, you, there's a part of you that says my god, can anybody live clean?
Phillip Rich:you know, it's true, that's how you feel. It's like dude. Um. You know that episode of the office when dwight shrewd said we all shall fall. You know, start wondering if that's going to be you.
David McIntyre:I mean, it's just like my gosh, it's just, it's wild man. And Ravi. I learned so much from Ravi Zacharias, so much I took away from his ministry. It was because of him that I was able to pull away from our other church that we were in. He was the one that helped me finally see that there was more to God's plan than just one place.
David McIntyre:Yeah that's right and that there wasn't only one person or one group of people that have all of God's wisdom and everybody else is just off of there. God's got wisdom planted all over the place and it's up to us to find it. And I was like he's absolutely right and that gave me the courage and the wisdom and the insight to move, and I did. And it's like then you wake up and see that what he was doing and it's like, if you know, now you understand.
David McIntyre:When we were talking a couple weeks ago about bearing one another's burdens and being careful to check yourself and not think more highly of yourself than you ought to, because you could find yourself caught up in that same stuff, dude, and you know how many people did they deal with that, were dealing with the issues that they were dealing with and did they get rid of. You know the humility necessary to deal with these people and the thing that was on them came on them. You know there's just, there's so much, just so much.
Phillip Rich:You're right, man, and you know it's so interesting, man, it's like, I think, sometimes, honestly, david, and tell me what you think about it, man, I think that sometimes, because of the platform these people have, because of the fame that they ended up, you know, acquiring, or whatever you want to call it, after a while, if they started struggling privately, maybe they felt like they couldn't, you know, come to somebody because it's like, man, I'm, I'm holding up the banner out here, you know, I'm like, I can't be perceived as spiritually, you know, in a bad place, and so it's almost like they're, they're but don't you think that's part of the trap?
David McIntyre:It is a hundred there in lies. Part of the trap. Yeah, Again, to be thinking so highly of yourself say I can't go to somebody else and ask for and get the help I need.
Phillip Rich:That's right. And you know what dude I partially blame and I'm going to be honest and I hate to throw this out here I partially blame the entire evangelical industrial complex at this point, because we have put people on pedestals that they don't belong on in the body of christ.
Phillip Rich:singers, preachers, uh, you name it, it doesn't matter, just any any famous person prophetic ministry gifts whatever whatever, we put people on pedestals and we hold conferences with them and we, you know, hype the person who's coming, you know as some kind of almost like celebrity status, and even the way some churches are structured and the way that you know the ministers go about their business. You know they got one person driving them to the church, the other person opening the car door, one guy carrying the dude's Bible, and it's like dude, you're off so badly with anything having to do with true humility that the bible talks about. You know, I think, because after a while you start believing your own crap. You start believing your own press.
Phillip Rich:You get exalted in your own mind and you know I think it may have been david and um when nathan called him out about his sin with bathsheba, it it was either him or Saul, one of the two. But God confronted him through the prophet and said when you were little in your own sight, you did what I told you to do.
Phillip Rich:But now that you're big in your own sight, you think you can do your own thing, you know, and so part of it, I think, of course, lies on the person who's doing the wrong, but then also the environment that they're in, that we've created in the body of Christ, with all this celebrity cult of personality bullcrap. They are struggling with something they don't feel like they can go to anybody about it, because then they might. Oh gosh, I don't want to be perceived as having fallen from grace or whatever the case is.
David McIntyre:Yeah, but here's the wild thing, Like with Michael, at the end of his thing he talked about the reason why he pulled away from the one band that he was working with at the beginning of the year is because he went into rehab and so it's like okay, so six months ago, and he said he's been clean since then, but six months ago you did the very thing that you could have done 20 years ago.
David McIntyre:Yeah, and you. I don't know whether you believed the lie that you know, if anybody found out or any of that stuff, but look at the end result. In order to get out, you still needed to do the same thing you needed to do at the beginning, and that was ask someone outside of yourself for help to pull you from the fire.
Phillip Rich:Ask someone outside of yourself for help to pull you from the fire. Goodness gracious, wow, that's good, david, and and you know that takes humility. That takes humility and, honestly, sometimes I believe in this. Maybe even in this case with Michael Tate. It's like I think that this exposure is actually the mercy of God, because a person can go headlong and stay in that pattern to their own destruction eventually, if something doesn't happen to break up that pattern, dude, it's wild and you know Paul talked about it in um, I think, first Corinthians 5, when he was saying you know, there's a dude who was in major sin in the church.
Phillip Rich:He said you know what this person? We got to deliver over, hand them over to the devil for the destruction of the flesh so their spirit can be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. And it's like evidently there's some spiritual principle at work where some people make an early exit out of this earth so their soul can be saved and they don't experience eternal destruction.
Jon Dzyuba:I mean that's right there in the word I don't know.
Phillip Rich:There's people that argue about once saved, always saved and other stuff like that, but that's in the word. It's in the word also, and I'm not saying that I don't believe in once saved, always saved. I think we need to do a lot of research on that is what I think.
David McIntyre:Before we go any further, let's share with the people what we're drinking tonight. Yes, sorry.
Phillip Rich:On a lighter topic.
David McIntyre:I just realized I was sipping in my cup. I was like oh, we never talked about this.
Phillip Rich:Well, David, why don't we start with you then? What is in your cup tonight?
David McIntyre:I got my grumpy cup out today because I'm feeling grumpy about this bad news today About more people falling. And tonight I am drinking New England coffee's butter pecan.
Phillip Rich:That's a beautiful thing. That's a beautiful thing, man.
David McIntyre:Sorry for the dusty looking lid there. I didn't see that I had junk on it. That means it's just a quality used coffee.
Phillip Rich:It's just vintage. It has a vintage appearance.
Jon Dzyuba:Vintage dirt.
Phillip Rich:John. What about you, sir? What are you drinking tonight?
Jon Dzyuba:I was drinking a cold brew. I got a little inspired from mr uncle phil and also a little bit of the heat this summer and I just couldn't do a hot drink today.
Jon Dzyuba:I'm sorry, but I had a little bit of a cold brew, added some, um, cold foam, and it's just, it's delightful, it's just sweet enough. It's just like it's giving me the boost that I need tonight. Uh, because I've been, I've been struggling to stay awake until we started drinking this coffee, so, um, that's what's in my cup I've got this is one from a company called Calde's Coffee and it is the decaf dancing goats.
Phillip Rich:I normally get this from a place in Peachtree City called Bloom Organics Bloom Coffee and Organics or something like that. It's a cool little coffee shop. We go to a lot, but this is a very nice decaf man. It's delicious. Heavy whipping cream and the decaf together makes a great combination. Wow.
Jon Dzyuba:I'm going to need you to take off that Peregrine hat for the rest of the episode, Phil.
Phillip Rich:Brand loyalty man.
David McIntyre:We'll get him addicted to something else soon.
Phillip Rich:Oh, my goodness. Peregrine you're always number one man.
David McIntyre:You know, philip, I think that we're interested in.
David McIntyre:A years ago, we were seeing all these stories about deconstruction mm-hmm you know, and all these, all these christians, you know, uh, the guy gunger from the band gunger, uh, one of my favorite songs, vapor if you've never heard it, it is a dope tune, okay, um, but you know, from that band he decided he was going, he was going to deconstruct as well and again, deconstruct is just code, for I'm walking away from Jesus right now. We heard from him. We heard from Kevin. Not Kevin Mack, that's Toby Mack.
Phillip Rich:I forget Kevin's last name oh well, they called him Kevin Max with an X on it.
David McIntyre:Max, that's what it was, max.
Phillip Rich:Yeah, dc Talk.
David McIntyre:Yeah, dc Talk and others who were deconstructing and creating again the God of their own thinking, and you know, we seem to be going through these cycles of variations of this. This is different, though's there's walking away from god, and then there's this concept of falling away, yeah, and where you are so caught up in your life, sins and the things that are going on that, uh, you don't choose to fall. You're typically forced to have to communicate who you are, and it's just. I see so much of it right now.
David McIntyre:And I know you do too and what you guys don't see is you don't see the small local pastors. You're seeing pastors around the country who are getting found out for their sexual assaults on young women in their churches. You're seeing where people are stealing money. I saw a secretary I think it was a secretary of a church the other day who got caught having stolen some $570,000.
Phillip Rich:Good Lord, have mercy.
David McIntyre:From her church over like a 10-year period or 7 to 10 year period, and um, there's just this. I think. I think it's worth and it's it's sobering to say something that we've said before on this podcast, and it goes back to the scripture. You know, everybody who cries Lord, lord, is not of us. You know, jude tells us very clearly that there will be wolves in sheep's clothing, per se people who will enter in, but their intentions are no good. 2 Timothy 3 warns us about these wolves in sheep's clothing and these deceivers that would enter in to the body of Christ. So I think we have to start by taking a very sober look at ourselves and recognizing, just because we're part of the church, just because we attend a church, just because we call ourselves to be Christians and we study the word and all that good stuff, and we know other people do and we're all connected in the same church body doesn't mean they're not bad people amongst the good. That's right.
David McIntyre:That's right, and I think if we could just sober up right there that by itself can be the beginning of some sobriety. That would help us discern who the roaring lions are.
Phillip Rich:Come on, man. You know, david, you mentioned that scripture in Matthew. I was wondering, john, if you could pull that up, because I want us to look at that one in Matthew 7. I just think it's one of the most fascinating things that Jesus said, because we equate doing the work of ministry with some kind of awesome spiritual status, and sometimes that's simply not the case, and you'll see why right here in Matthew 7. Let's see. I think it's down, I think near the end of the chapter. Yeah, there it is, in verse 21, matthew 7, 21.
Phillip Rich:It says not everyone who says to me, lord, lord, will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my father, who is in heaven. That's interesting. He said a doer, someone who does, it's not the talking right, it's the doing. And he said in verse 22, many will say to me on that day Lord, lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name, drive out demons and in your name, perform many miracles? So these are people who are doing quote, unquote the work of the ministry, you know, or at least a work of ministry. And look what Jesus said. Then I will tell them plainly. It's like flat footed. I'm going to tell you I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers. Now wait a second. What part of driving out demons is evil? What part of prophesying is evil? What part of performing miracles is evil? The answer is nothing. The evil is doing those things while not living the life you know, because the spirit of God can come on you and use you as as as he wills.
Phillip Rich:But that doesn't mean that your personal life is all the way in order. A lot of times because we've seen it we've seen very gifted preachers who can get up on a Sunday and rile the whole crowd up and I mean, have a hundred people come to the altar to get saved, and that's that's, for all intents and purposes, that's a work of God. You know, people coming to get saved is awesome, but then we find out that same preacher is hooked on drugs, sleeping with prostitutes in his personal life or whatever else he's got going on, and it's like dude. You know, we could essentially say he never really knew Jesus, even though he had a gifting. Honestly, that gift was operating almost in spite of him. And so we had to realize, man, that's not what's going to get you into the kingdom of God, according to that scripture, because he said not everyone that does that kind of stuff is going to enter into the kingdom of heaven.
David McIntyre:Not everybody called me lord is actually submitted to me I love at the end of that verse where it calls them in the king james version it calls them workers of iniquity workers of iniquity working when you look at that word iniquity.
David McIntyre:It comes from the Greek word anomia and it means lawlessness, the utter disregard for God's law, his written and living word. That's a strong accusation that you may have done this, but you're a worker of iniquity. In other words, you're lawless, You're operating outside of God's written and living word. Wow, and I'll tell you. Here's what's so wild about it. I was just talking about Ravi Zacharias and how much I got from him and how much he gave me the courage to see things clearly. But I believe at that time that that was happening. He was still doing stuff that he was doing yeah.
Phillip Rich:So you see, even in the midst of he was still doing stuff that he was doing. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
David McIntyre:So you see, even in the midst of him doing bad, God still used him for good in my life.
Jon Dzyuba:Yeah, yeah.
David McIntyre:And you might ask well, how is it possible, if they're working on this wickedness in the background, how is it that they could give a word or do some of the things that they do? Well, I don't know all the details of it, you guys. To be honest with you, I just don't.
Phillip Rich:Me neither.
David McIntyre:But I know that God, as they say, he'll use a crooked stick to make a way straight.
Phillip Rich:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
David McIntyre:And I know that because of the condition of my heart at the time desperately and look. It also doesn't mean that these people are unknowledgeable of the word.
Phillip Rich:Right, right.
David McIntyre:And that they're unknowledgeable of how things go together and all of that. It means, in addition to their knowledge of the word, they also got some sin going on right alongside of that. Yeah, it doesn't make what you got twisted. I remember so many people when it came out about Ravi, so many people who had followed him for so many years some of them questioned everything they got out of him and I'm like, well, wait a minute, that's already tried and true.
David McIntyre:So we don't have to. We can question his lifestyle and do a check-in on his ministry, Because his ministry was good, but his lifestyle was poisoned.
Phillip Rich:Yeah, and I think that's probably the most damaging thing about when these types of situations happen is that not only does it turn people off to that particular minister, whoever, but sometimes they get turned off to God period, you know right they not only walk away from that church or whatever, they walk away from the faith altogether because, like you said, sometimes they begin to question everything like what, oh man, this person who I thought was anointed, I thought they had the gifting of God and turns out they're living like a hellion behind closed doors. Is God even real? You know, some people have that kind of thing going on in their mind at that point. And trust me when I say the sins of men have nothing to do with the omniscience and omnipresence of God. With the omniscience and omnipresence of God, you know, people will fall, people will rise, people will do this, that and the other, but God remains the same. He does not change. He is what his word says, he is and like it says in Romans 3, let God be true, but every man a liar.
David McIntyre:Every man. You know what's wild too, Philip. First of all, just because a man has committed sin doesn't mean Romans chapter 10 isn't true. Right you know the concept of salvation born out in Romans 10 is just as true for you as it is for me, and somebody could be living as wrong as the day is long and just simply read those verses to you and they will be right when they stick to those words that's right let me tell you, philip and I um, and we spent many years being taught some things that we've now come to realize that that wasn't a good interpretation of that scripture.
David McIntyre:That that wasn't that. That's not as we studied it out. That's not God's full intent in this Right. And do you? Do you always throw the baby out with the bath water? Philip, and I will still tell you we got some of the best teaching a man could get in this church. There were a couple things that were off, and we trust the word. We dug, trust the word, we dug into the word. Some of it we've dug into together and realized and believed that God's intent was something a little different than what we were taught. We don't throw that man out and say he's no good now. Now, since then we've heard him teach some other things in a little while.
Phillip Rich:Yeah, things have gotten a little worse over the past few years.
David McIntyre:We'll leave that alone, yeah we'll leave that alone for now.
David McIntyre:I'm just saying we have to be so careful. God's word is so precious and it's important that, if we don't hang on to anything else in this world, hang on to God's word. Yes, that's the thing. Hang on to that word. Y'all these graphic messages and do all this hooting and hollering and sing a song in the middle, carrying on and do all that kind of stuff. But in the end, what matters is you being anchored in the word itself, and that's why we do this the way that we do. That's why we incorporate so much word in it. That's why we can take our time at times and go through things with such detail and define words and put stuff together and connect the dots, because you need that, because it helps to anchor you in the way that you need to be anchored.
Phillip Rich:That's good man.
David McIntyre:I'm sorry, I'm done talking man.
Phillip Rich:No, no. You're saying exactly what I think needs to be said, man, because the written word of God is something that cannot be replaced. You shouldn't be chasing after prophetic gifts. You shouldn't be, you know. Let me just calm down. I don't want to say what anyone should or shouldn't be doing. Here's the.
David McIntyre:Thing.
Phillip Rich:I'm trying to be nice, david, I'm sorry.
David McIntyre:But no, I think you call it Because you're right in the sense that If you chase that word as hard as you chase those prophetic gifts, hoping somebody will give you a word, you already have a word.
David McIntyre:And it's written and it'll be God's promise for you that you can walk out in faith on and see productivity on. Why are you sitting around here trying to chase some dude around and hoping the parking lot he'll give you a and do all that stuff over you and make you feel emotionally somewhere but not actually be connected to the word? And I believe in prophetic words and I've received a prophetic word before, but I used to get so frustrated because the times I've gotten a prophetic word before, but I used to get so frustrated because the times I've gotten a prophetic word, it seems like maybe I've had two or three and I used to get so frustrated with that. Why didn't I get more prophetic words?
David McIntyre:Philip had a big, huge prophetic word. You know the whole church saw Philip's prophetic words, you know. And this person over here had a prophetic word that ended up on tbn and you know all this, all this other stuff, and you know I just I I had to come to this place where I was like god is anchoring you in his word yes be anchored in his word.
David McIntyre:That's right. Be okay with that. It's all the prophecy you'll ever need is already written. It's already written this.
Phillip Rich:It is dude that I was reading revelation. This is kind of a side note, but it just blew me away. In revelation it said the testimony of jesus is the spirit of prophecy. I just wanted to you. You know I was like dude, all this talk about prophecy, and the Bible explicitly defines what it actually is. In Revelation the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. I was like holy smokes. So that means you know the things that we say about him. And the reason why is because he is the word Right In the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God.
Phillip Rich:John, chapter one, verse one. He is the word and the word became flesh John 1, 14 and dwelled among us. But that word in its original form was not a human being walking around in modern day Palestine. That word was the eternal logos, or logos, however you say it, of God that has been around forever. And if you study what that word word even means in the Greek, when it talks about in the beginning was the word John 1 1. It talks about in the beginning was the word John 1.1. It is that word, logos, which means a thought or an expression, an idea. And when you break it down, that means that Jesus is the expressed thoughts and ideas of the Father. That's what it's saying. He is the word, the expression of God.
Phillip Rich:And this written word, which I think this is the most fascinating thing to me, because it seems like it's a trend now in modern day Christianity to discount the written word. And I'm like dude, no, jesus reverenced. He had a profound reverence for the written word. He had a profound reverence for it. Every time the Pharisees ever came to him with some kind of question to try to trip him up, he would always say well, wait a minute. What's written in your law? You know what does the law read? And there were several places in the gospels where he said you know, heaven and earth will pass away, but my word won't pass away. And in John 10, he said the scripture cannot be broken. He was talking about the written scripture. So Jesus had a profound respect for the word, the written word.
Phillip Rich:And I think as soon as we depart from that, dude, we're already off base. Man, you're going to get into some spooky, weird crap where people start talking about the visions they've had of the spirit of Burger King. Mcdonald's came to them and or whatever it was that they you know, and all that stuff, sorry, all this kind of stuff that just doesn't make any sense and it can't be proven scripturally. You don't need to be chasing that kind of stuff. Don't chase after these gifts and these visions and feathers fell down from the, you know, the rooftop in the sanctuary. Don't look at all that stuff, man. Signs and wonders are not. They're not even close to the level that the word should be in your life. They're not on the same level at all. You should be able to go your whole life without seeing one sign or one wonder and still know that God's word is eternally true in faith.
David McIntyre:Right and look, and because you're faithful to the word, you'll see the signs and wonders. There you go. It's the law of reciprocity. Yeah, it's just how it works. You know, Philip, I can't remember where the scripture is, but it warns us that in the last I believe it's in the last days. I just don't remember where it is and I don't remember all of the verse right now, but it warned us in the last days that we're going to have to, things are going to be in such a way that we're going to have to have the help of the Spirit of the Lord to discern between right and wrong.
Phillip Rich:Yeah, for sure.
David McIntyre:And what's good and evil.
Phillip Rich:That's right.
David McIntyre:And you can't have that apart from the word no. No, you need that, if nothing else because the word reveals God's pattern and plan.
Phillip Rich:Yep that's right.
David McIntyre:And you'll be able to recognize it when you see it. Yeah, that's right, and you'll be able to recognize it when you see it, yeah.
David McIntyre:And you'll have the. Of course, you'll have the help of the Holy Spirit as well with it. The other thing I wanted to say real quick, philip, is Jesus is revealed in the scripture. That's right. The disciples you know now the apostles, or you know Paul others were able to discern who he was. Was well, jesus, of course, revealed himself and showed up and taught them who he was, but they were also able to see him revealed in the New Old Testament.
Jon Dzyuba:In the Old Testament, not the New.
David McIntyre:Old Testament, not the New Old Testament.
Phillip Rich:Right, I get you.
David McIntyre:In the Old Testament, paul, a Jewish scholar above them. That's why we have the book of Romans, because it was Paul preaching specifically to the Jews Jesus, yeah, yeah and I just it's Jews Jesus, yeah, or was that Hebrew? Did I get that backwards? Is that Hebrews?
Phillip Rich:Well, hebrews, he does definitely do it, but in Romans 2, because in Romans 3, he addresses the Jews directly. He's like you call yourself a Jew, you this and that.
David McIntyre:So yeah, I mean it's all through there. But in both books, paul constantly takes us back to the Old Testament and I'm thinking about Hebrews right now because he talks, he opens it up and he talks about the word of the angels.
David McIntyre:If the word of the angels meant this, then how much more when the Son of God says this when he talks about the concept of the rest and that rest was based upon what was talked about in the Old Testament bought forward into the New. And then how he introduces to us as Jesus the high priest after the order of Melchizedek, still dealing in the Old Testament, representing who Jesus is in comparison to these Old Testament pieces of the puzzle. And he goes on and on, and on and on.
David McIntyre:And you know we he is. Jesus is revealed to us through the scripture, yes, and so we can get to know him better and know of him by the again the time we spend in the scripture. I'll be honest with you, I've been. As I'm sitting here talking about this, I realized how much I've been cheating myself of good scripture. Wow. And so I got to make an adjustment, but I bet I'm not the only one, and so I've got to make an adjustment, but I bet I'm not the only one.
Phillip Rich:Well, hey look, I've been there many times for sure. You know you go through peaks and valleys in life and seasons where it seems like it's a dry season sometimes and it's harder to get things from the word than other times. And the biggest thing when you encounter those times is to just continue to push forward, continue to trust in the system of seed, time and harvest where, if I plant this word in me, then I believe that there will be some benefit from it. You know, I believe there'll be some type of a harvest to come from it. And don't get me wrong, I've had plenty of times where I didn't get into it like I should have, you know.
Phillip Rich:But at the but, you know, at the same time, I know that when you are low on the word, it's easy for discouragement to set in for depression, to set in for anxiety, to set in for fear, to set in. It's like the word really is spiritual food, just like when you're hungry physically, you haven't had any food, it's easy to get bummed out, it's easy to get irritable, you know it's easy to get frustrated or whatever it is, because you just hadn't ate. You know, like like the Snickers commercials, where they're like you know you're hangry, you know hungry and angry or whatever. Like you're hangry, hungry and angry or whatever. It's that same kind of thing Like a lack of word in your life, a lack of soaking in the word and spending time in the written word. It can produce these effects spiritually to where you don't have the ammunition you need or the defense that you need against all the stuff that tries to chip away at you every day. Just living in this world, you know, temptation seems a little more hard to deal with, and sometimes conflict with other people is harder to get over, different things like that, because your word balance is low. And so this is what David and I want to encourage you guys Get into the written word of God and, just like David was talking about earlier, the New Testament man, there's hundreds of quotations from the Old Testament in the New Testament.
Phillip Rich:You know, they believed strongly. All the apostles, all the people who wrote the New Testament, they believed strongly in the written word of God. And I remember something that one of my favorite Bible teachers ever, a gentleman named Chuck Missler. He said the Old Testament is the New Testament concealed, and the New Testament is the Old Testament revealed, and I used to love that whole. I just love the way that works. It's like they're integrated, you know, and, like David said, the common theme throughout the entire thing is Jesus, like everything points to him and him being the personified word of God.
David McIntyre:So I don't know how I got off on this this far, david, but oh, no, no, no, you got off on a good point and I'll say I'll add to that. This is why, when somebody tries to teach you, you don't need the Old Testament anymore.
Phillip Rich:Oh, my goodness.
David McIntyre:You should immediately step on out. Yeah.
Phillip Rich:And I've heard it from very prominent ministers Christians shouldn't concern themselves with the Old Testament. That's not your covenant. I'm like bruh. That's not your covenant. I'm like bruh Everything that makes the new covenant is based on the foundation of the old covenant. I don't know how people can think that it's irrelevant now. That is completely ridiculous. It battles me. It's sad.
David McIntyre:Alright, phil, we've got to put a bookmark right here. It's bad, but anyway All right.
Phillip Rich:Phil, we've got to put a bookmark right here.
David McIntyre:We still haven't got to our second, Peter man, we actually have a chapter and verse and stuff that we're going to do. It's going to be the foundation of our study.
Jon Dzyuba:Yes.
David McIntyre:Just shut up and just get to it.
Phillip Rich:We promise you, peaky, promise we do actually have a foundation scripture for this whole series, but we did want to just thank you for tuning in tonight or today, whenever you listen to it, and we want to just make sure that you, to encourage you again, get into the written word of God, spend time in the written word of God.
Phillip Rich:I know I could be spending a lot more time. I've had my ups and downs and and, but the one thing that I try to do every single day is at least lay eyes on a scripture before my head hits the pillow that night. I try to make that some a habit that I want to continue in all the days of my life. And I know, david, you and I, you know we've been at this thing for probably gosh, at least close to 30 years, I think, just walking with the Lord as best as we can. And it's like you know, there will be seasons, there will be ups and downs. So if you feel like you're in that kind of a season now, don't get discouraged, man, you know persistence is the key.
David McIntyre:Persistence is the key.
Phillip Rich:Persistence is the key. Don't think that you're not doing enough If you start small. Don't think that it's insignificant. Any step in that direction is significant. We promise you that, because God can take the faith the size of a mustard seed and make something great out of it, you know. So we want to just encourage you in that to continue seeking God, continue reading the scripture. Take time just in your it could be five minutes, you know take time out of the day just to lay your eyes on some scripture. I just want to encourage you in that.
Phillip Rich:And, of course, if you need help knowing which scriptures, you can always tune in to Bible Bros and Brew. We mentioned quite a few of them on our podcast. But again, thanks for watching you guys. And if you have any questions or concerns or suggestions or things you'd like to see us cover on the podcast, whatever the case is, we have an email for that. It is gotbrewatbiblebrosnet. Once again, gotbrewatbiblebrosnet. And, of course, please like, share, subscribe, comment all those good things that we encourage people to do. If there's a button to smash in that regard, please smash it.
David McIntyre:We appreciate you for that and don't forget in just a couple of weeks, about two weeks time, you'll start being able to get the podcast on Mondays at 6 am instead of Tuesday, so you'll take note of that. Turn your notifications on and you should be notified when that hits. Awesome, Awesome.
Phillip Rich:Any final words or final thoughts.
David McIntyre:David. No, let me just pray for you real quick. Yes, sir.
David McIntyre:Father, we love you and we thank you for a night together with our friends and those people here who just are seeking after you. I just pray that you guide and lead them, father. You help them in the hard places they might find themselves in tonight. Lord God, you are the God of wisdom, you have the answers and you know how to bring us out from the places that we may find ourselves right now. Help us, father, help us by your spirit, help us, lord God, and show us the way forward In Jesus' name. In Jesus' name.
Phillip Rich:Amen. All right, good people, we will see you next time. Until then, keep digging into the word and much love Peace.
